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Joe Man




Joined: 21 Jan 2004
Posts: 742
Location: S. Latitude 47°9', W. Longitude 123°43'

PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Huh?

Just to clarify, I only mean the filetype discussion.
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Last edited by Joe Man on Fri Dec 13, 1957 1:21 am; edited 2,892 time in total
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Chenzi
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Joined: 02 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By "hard coded", you mean what in which language? Raspberry!
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TMC
On the Verge of Insanity




Joined: 05 Apr 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm? With the exception of SDL's support for RLE compression of software surfaces, graphics are pretty much always uncompressed for display when loaded.

I ran into dozens of PNG quantizers a couple days ago when I was trying to look for quantizing algorithms (of which I found a real drought of available source code) but none of their descriptions mention whether they support 8bit colour with 8 bit alpha channels, so it'd be a real slog to find one.
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Bob the Hamster
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Mad Cacti wrote:
Hmm? With the exception of SDL's support for RLE compression of software surfaces, graphics are pretty much always uncompressed for display when loaded.

I ran into dozens of PNG quantizers a couple days ago when I was trying to look for quantizing algorithms (of which I found a real drought of available source code) but none of their descriptions mention whether they support 8bit colour with 8 bit alpha channels, so it'd be a real slog to find one.


Yeah. After searching around some more, and reading http://www.libpng.org/pub/png/pngsuite.html I am beginning to think that page I referenced was wrong.

I do know that there are methods in SDL of loading an 8-bit paletted picture and then adding alpha transparency to it from a separate 8-bit greyscale png, but that might be more trouble than it is worth.
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TMC
On the Verge of Insanity




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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 3:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.w3.org/TR/PNG-DataRep.html:

Quote:
An alpha channel, representing transparency information on a per-pixel basis, can be included in grayscale and truecolor PNG images.


Disappointing, but palette colours can be chosen from a RGBA space, which might be good enough.
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chenzi wrote:
By "hard coded", you mean what in which language? Raspberry!


Dark Basic Pro :S
Better than the initial idea (Visual Basic was way too limitating on so many levels). And sorry if this isn't C++, but I wouldn'T consider going in C++ unless I actually did 3d stuff. Otherwise, it gives you a lot of performance boost for... nothing? Besides, I've decided to pick what I was best with. I've been coding in basic languages ever since I was like 7... (seriously speaking). I know for a fact my first "written" keyboard thingy was a print "hello world" kinda statement XD
So ya, took the easy path.
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And sorry if this isn't C++, but I wouldn'T consider going in C++ unless I actually did 3d stuff. Otherwise, it gives you a lot of performance boost for... nothing?
There's also the fact that C/C++ can be cross-platform depending on the compiler you're using.
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Artimus Bena
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Joined: 17 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I donno. I see a lot of the technical side of this game, but that's only half what would make we want to work on a game. Give me the graphics and a list a features, and I see gimmicks. I need more. At least a story premise. You say "epic plot", but lots of epic plots cause epic boredom, no offense. And I've never been a believer in alternate endings. It defeats the purpose of telling a concise story (which really is a medium through which to convey a definite message.) If there's no definite message, then you're making the video-game equivilant of a short-lived summer thriller movie. The new war-of-the-worlds is a great example. Or 300. (Haha 300 was good, they just pushed for that epic feel just a bit too intensely, and it made the film a little two-dimensional). But then 300 at least had a definite message to give, which is why it'll always leave the new war of the worlds in its dust.


Anyway, these are my theories, I thought you'd like to hear them.
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Joe Man




Joined: 21 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Artimus Bena wrote:
(Haha 300 was good, they just pushed for that epic feel just a bit too intensely, and it made the film a little two-dimensional)
Hell, what made that movie bad was the story they added from the graphic novel. Otherwise it was plain hardcore and awesome.
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Last edited by Joe Man on Fri Dec 13, 1957 1:21 am; edited 2,892 time in total
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Artimus Bena wrote:
I donno. I see a lot of the technical side of this game, but that's only half what would make we want to work on a game. Give me the graphics and a list a features, and I see gimmicks. I need more. At least a story premise. You say "epic plot", but lots of epic plots cause epic boredom, no offense. And I've never been a believer in alternate endings. It defeats the purpose of telling a concise story (which really is a medium through which to convey a definite message.) If there's no definite message, then you're making the video-game equivilant of a short-lived summer thriller movie. The new war-of-the-worlds is a great example. Or 300. (Haha 300 was good, they just pushed for that epic feel just a bit too intensely, and it made the film a little two-dimensional). But then 300 at least had a definite message to give, which is why it'll always leave the new war of the worlds in its dust.


Anyway, these are my theories, I thought you'd like to hear them.


Well I've officially hired 2 more artists this week, so expect updated screenshots in may Happy
Also, I didn't want to focus on the plot for two main reasons. A) We're working for a tech demo build release in august which will have nearly no plot interest except perhaps a few spoilers as to what the game is about... and second, the theme is of a book I'm writing as an essay to be added as an annex to my master which I'm about to run into, so for this reason, I can't quite risk giving it away until I published the actual document... Of course, the team is aware of the story itself and have helped modify it, but I can only show that to a select few trusted people. No offense to CP there, but anyone can click on here accidentally and just read, they don't even need to be a member, so this will have to wait.

The difference between a movie and a game is the player interactivness. Now, don't expect this to go the massive way, we're talking about only bonus endings, whereas there's definately a default one which makes the most sense. We're mostly building on the replayability factor there (remember, this game is made in the Chrono Trigger style afterall). Also, since the endings are already layed out, I think most of them are simply one portion of the whole thing. Beating the game in different ways simply lets you understand better the underlying secrets. the "untold".

Also, I think one should bear in mind that by alternate endings, I'm not exactly thinking ala Deus Ex's endings (where you basically choose which faction takes over the world :S). So, yes, sadly, so far, the game has to relay only upon its technological features and although the story is set up, I'm aware of the consequences that not publishing even a short excerpt might cause as far as getting serious individuals concerned, but this is a choice... (out of utter paranoia of potential theft?!)...
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Artimus Bena
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been generally agreed by pretty much every writer that there is no original story, just "orginal" combinations of elements. So yeah, I think you're being very paranoid, and you'd probably get the public-interest ball rolling, if you at least had a simple premise to go off of. Seriously, it only has to be a sentence or two.

Aaaaaand even when I beat chrono trigger, knowing that there were other endings... I did not go back and beat it again to see the other endings. I think, generally, people don't care that much about alternate endings; not enough to play the game over again. Basically, the re-play value has more to do with the gameplay. I personally do not believe in "bonus" endings either, for the same reason. It's kinda pointless to me. But that's me : )

I also am kinda hesitant because of the "based off chrono trigger" comments. It's a lot like hero worship, and less like making an original game. I don't mean to blast your game before I play it, I'm just wondering to what degree you're basing your gameplay on CT. Because you mention that game a lot. And I'll tell you something, every time I started on some idea that was inspired by chrono trigger, I never ever finished the project.

: p

Hope I haven't bruised any egos.
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Joe Man




Joined: 21 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It does depend very greatly amongst games and users. Very often with games I try to squeeze out every ounce of playability, and even find my own ways to do it. In Wario World, for example, I even went back to beat the game without freeing any of those impish freaks while getting everything else.
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~Charles Martin Jones

Last edited by Joe Man on Fri Dec 13, 1957 1:21 am; edited 2,892 time in total
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Joe Man




Joined: 21 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Topic change!

I don't have much of a portfolio to offer, just some random fun junk I've whipped up, so perhaps if you could throw a minor assignment at me before my Pro Motion trial expires you could judge me off of that.

Sound good?
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~Charles Martin Jones

Last edited by Joe Man on Fri Dec 13, 1957 1:21 am; edited 2,892 time in total
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
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Location: Under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Artimus: I see your opinion is heavily based on perception, and so is mind. Therefore, I'm not gonna try to convince you. But, for the record, I did play chrono throughout to get all the endings, and I did up all characters' skills up to level 99.
As far as being "copied off" chrono comes in, well, for starters, the graphical input and plotline are somewhat irrelevant, as in they don't really match one another well. Similarly, most of the game is significantly different. What I meant by basing this off Chrono was to base it of what Chrono had that made it a success, and mostly on the systems' point of view. The battle system we're coding is semi-real-time like the one in chrono (but with several fixes which makes, even IT, much different than the one used in CTs). I want to express here that I have an aversion for "fangames" myself, and as such, never in my entire life will I do a "new magus", and this, as much as I'd love to... Magus WAS done, and I just can't try to make a revamp 2.00 of him XD So if that was the kind of things you were affraid I would drop into, fear not.
As far as being original comes in, the story is NOT original, nor did it even try to be. We use several cliches, don't use others. We picked a theme and tried to take the best out of it, and the theme is NOT time travel (I absolutely can't come across any game that uses this theme and not feel like its a theft from CT...). Time travel was very popular in the 90s' science-fiction universe, and I think a lot of movies/games used it very well. I don't personally have to offer any new "cool" interpretation of time travel, none worth making a game based on it, and as such, I didn't use this theme (at all) in the process of crafting the lore of this game.
It seems the 21rst century is forged around the critic around the catholic church (and as much as I didn't like the Da Vinci code, it is but one book in a series of published works on the topic).
My personal professionnal career is in medieval studies, and anyone who would've studied them (and I'm sure, a lot of profane) will understand that with studying the middle ages comes a study of the christianity itself. The very name of this game (Angel's Earth) hints towards this direction. Without spoiling anything here, the largest lore of this game is, as far as we can tell, authentic, but it might not be about what you expect it to be.... *shhhhhh* Raspberry!
Lastly, I would like to point out that, although we are working heavily on the replayability value, nothing of this will be implemented until we have insured a good degree of play value. This game is a classic one player rpg where the player is brought in a universe of fiction, and we understand that before adding replayability to it, we must give the player one heck of an experience to keep him/her coming. That's the main focus, obviously, but I've always liked the idea that, after letting one game lay down for months/years and feeling like beating it again, you don't get the chance to do 100% the same thing if you don't want to. Different endings are not all there is, and on this, we also borrow a little from Deus Ex's possibility system Happy

Joeman: Here's a good assignment idea for you if you feel up for the task. Make a tree thats 2 tiles high (tiles are 24X24 double sized for the classic pixel feeling Wink) 32 bits pngs for now. If your tree is good, we'll talk about the modalities Wink
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