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PrePlan for Improved Items

 
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msw188




Joined: 02 Jul 2003
Posts: 1041

PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 7:48 am    Post subject: PrePlan for Improved Items Reply with quote

After The Mad Cacti mentioned the lack of a plan for better items in my thread on the Help forum, I thought maybe we as a community could start working towards one. So let's use this thread to decide what kinds of options should be available in custom for items. Some of these suggestions are probably already on Bugzilla as feature requests, but it might be nice to have this one thread to discuss this. Here are some of mine:

*Ability to call a script, along with passing it an user-definable argument

*Ability to change the effect of using an item based on tags; an interface like the door-linking menu might be nice, one for each item

*Ability to change equippability based on tags, similar to above

*Ability to be equippable in more than one slot, and having stat gains depend on what slot the item is equipped in

*Ability to disable unequipping (cursed equipment)

*Ability to set, on a per item basis, the maximum amount of any item allowed to the player, although I'm not sure how game should handle the player obtaininga new item after he has hit the max... perhaps each such item would also have an option to set a script to call upon reaching overtaking the max, and if none is selected then the item simply disappears? Then it is the author's job to set up a script to handle what happens.

*Ability to be unable to sell, yet be consumed by use

*Ability to set a default selling price. Actually, a customizable global default percentage for selling price might be nice too (it's 50% right now)

*Of course, I still dream of individualized item menues, but I've already made my dream a reality, haha. That said, if they ever became part of the engine, I would be simultaneously elated and infuriated
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FnrrfYgmSchnish
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
*Ability to be equippable in more than one slot, and having stat gains depend on what slot the item is equipped in


This would have been insanely useful back in 2002 or so when I was working on Spuduf Splorchers.

One of the main parts of the game is how these little spirit-thingies called "Spuduf" could be equipped, and I had used three slots for them (with only one for armor and one for weapons), but it was kind of limited by how you could only put certain Spuduf in certain slots.
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JSH357
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Parent-child relationships between items, or the ability to edit item properties via plotscripting.
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Bagne
ALL YOUR NUDIBRANCH ARE BELONG TO GASTROPODA




Joined: 19 Feb 2003
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Parent-child relationships between items

I don't understand.

* Item extra data!
* An equivalent to Resident Evil's system of "combining" items to produce a new item.
* A PS command which brings up the player's inventory, the player selects an item, and the item's ID is returned.
* A way for text boxes to prompt item use. Like ... the text says:
"The door is locked" (OK / USE ITEM) <- and the second option brings up your inventory.
I suppose that the latter suggestion is already easily do-able.

Those would be awesome for puzzle making.

Other ideas:
The ability to associate portraits
Names longer than 8 characters?
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JSH357
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mean, the ability to make items on the fly that are just like other items but with minor differences (hence, changing properties via scripting).
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Bagne
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oo. I like that.
Might that make game-saving a little tricky ... ?
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Moogle1
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Joined: 15 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2010 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They're changing the save format to something more freeform anyway. After that, other improvements will flow like milk and honey.
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Blue Pixel
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PostPosted: Sun May 09, 2010 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
*Ability to be equippable in more than one slot


YES!
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TMC
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, I'm seeing a clear pattern in certain requests. I've started writing a proposal: Plan for improved items which so far covers improvements to equipment and item use. I think that covers all the relevant requests I've heard so far, aside from cursed equipment which I'm less sure about (maybe a global bitset (as opposed to an Equip Entry), controlled by tag conditions?). Comments soght. But it does seem like it creates too much work when creating multiple Equip Entries that share a lot of data, such as equipping an item in multiple slots, but for the same heroes, and with the same stats and elemental bitsets each time. Adding keys to let you copy and paste this seems pretty awkward.

I'm very interested in being able to modify items with scripts to create unique items.

Quote:
Parent-child relationships between items


An item type hierarchy sounds like a great simplifying idea! So if you have a base item "HvySwrd", we could add script commands that accept "item:HvySwrd" as an argument, and search for/count/delete/equip any HvySwrds and child items such as a modified +1 damage HvySwrd.

More feedback later...
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The Drizzle
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

* Percentage based stat increases/decreases(e.g. +10% Atk, -20% Def)
* Multiple inventories. This could have a number of good uses but just off the top of my head:
- Giving each character their own inventory
- Setting up some kind of banking system
- Treating treasure chests something like Fallout or Elder Scrolls (you can take items or leave them in different places)
* System to import/export huge lists of items (like we have with text boxes). This would make item copy/pasting and large scale edits much easier.
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Bagne
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2010 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was just thinking about plotscripting up a multiple-inventory system for S&S.
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msw188




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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2010 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some more thoughts concerning equipment:

*Have equipment changeable AND usable in battle!!!

*Have weapons a bitset to be endowed with an 'attack' element (or elements). This does nothing by itself but...

*Have attacks have a bitset "Use equipped weapon's 'attack' elemental bitsets"

PS: to Bagne (and anyone else interested), the download for Tales 2 at Slime Salad contains the scripts used to make the individualized item menues, if you'd like to see how one person did it (I still do believe I am the first to do so while still using the OHR's battle system)
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My first completed OHR game, Tales of the New World:
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Bagne
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PostPosted: Wed May 19, 2010 4:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool!
May I wade through those included script files?
Which one contains the multiple inventory stuff?
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msw188




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PostPosted: Wed May 19, 2010 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course you can wade all you like. The text file "BetterItemSystem" was my beginning planning document (no scripts, just a basic outline that slowly changed as I began coding). The file "TNW2ItemScripts" has the majority of the scripts relevant to maintaining the individual items, but it's not commented particularly well (or maybe much at all...).

As always, if you have any questions just ask! I'm fairly proud of my system (I remember thinking that I had actually impressed TMC with using levelMP for item usage in battle), but there are lots of quirks that need to be maintained in custom to keep it all running smoothly (treasure chests need to both call a specific script AND give the item that they are supposed to, although this will be deleted from standard inventory by the script). Equipping also needed some thought...

Ah, you'll see.
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My first completed OHR game, Tales of the New World:
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This website link is for my funk/rock band, Euphonic Brew:
www.euphonicbrew.com
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